Welcome to my blog's tactics page! With the new Horus Heresy 2.0 up and running, and after a few games with my Questoris Knights in the Age of Darkness, I've finally decided to set aside some time to write. Oh, and not to mention, the Liber Mechanicum has been out for a while now, so yeah.
I know no one is going to read this, but I want to leave a blog post here just in case 1d4chan goes down again and you need a Tactics page for Knights. Anyway, without further ado, let's begin!
Why Play Questoris Knights?
Because they are cool. I mean, you are literally fielding an army of giant robots. Some might be smaller than others, but essentially, you have a bunch of mechs marching across the field.
You also have scoring Armigers with Line. That's right. Everyone who plays Horus Heresy knows how strong Contemptor Dreadnoughts are. And Armigers are pretty much pseudo Contemptor Dreadnoughts! Basically, you have durable scoring Line troops with high Toughness and many wounds, as well as Eternal Warrior.
Not only that, your super-heavy Knights have relatively high armor values (at least 13 for the front armor), as well as decent invulnerable saves from ion shields that keep them in the fight. That makes them immune to small arms fire such as bolters and heavy bolters, and even melta weapons and lascannons will need their Armorbane and Sunder to wound them.
Their weapons are also terrifying. Knights have plenty of High Strength blast weapons or high volume shots with Rending, that allows them to tackle anything from hordes to Space Marines to vehicles. Funnily enough, the only thing they can't really kill effectively are Dreadnoughts, but you have the stomps for that. I think.
Do take note that you will always have an army with a very low count and few models, so each Knight lost will hurt a lot (even the Armigers, which are your only way of scoring). And despite the ion shields providing survivability against ranged anti-tank weapons, they don't do anything against melee weapons (with a few exceptions), so you're still vulnerable to chainfists.
Warlord Traits
Questoris Knights seem to only have a single Warlord Trait. I mean, some argument can be made that the Mechanicum specific Warlord Traits can be used, such as The Logic of Victory or the Science of Slaughter, but...they don't seem logical or even remotely useful for Knights. They don't get pinned (your Armigers do, but requires them to be within 6" of your Warlord), and obviously you want your Knight to be shooting or in combat, so the Logic of Victory isn't practical. Also, the Science of Slaughter's +1 to Strength isn't useful to a Knight whose Strength is already 8 or 9.
That leave the Seneschal's Warlord Trait, Master of the Household, which allows the Warlord and all Knights within 8" to perform Reactions even though Knights normally can't unless against other Knights and super-heavies. Also gives them an additional Reaction during the opponent's shooting phase. But wait! You cry. Knights are vehicles, and they can only fire defensive weapons in a Reaction! Well, the joke's on you, Legiones Astartes player. Arm mounted weapons like that tasty thermal cannon you see on my Knight Errant always count as defensive weapons.
Wargear and Special Rules
Wargear
Ion Shield: Super-heavy Knights get a 4++ invulnerable save to their front armor and a 5++ invunlnerable save to their sides against shooting weapons. Does nothing in melee.
Ionic Deflector: Armigers get this slightly downgraded ion shield, but you don't have to worry about facings and whatnot. It gives an all-round 5++ invulnerable save, and it's not only against shooting. Unlike regular 40K, Armigers get an invulnerable save in melee as well!
Weapons
Heavy Stubber: Standard auto weapon with 3 Strength 4 shots. Cheap, but don't expect it to do anything.
Meltagun: Expensive, but Strength 8 with melta (armorbane) means that it can reliably vaporize anything you point it at, be it a Terminator or a tank. Well, you probably wouldn't blow up a tank in one shot unless you get really lucky, but there is very little it cannot threaten. Since it's Strengh 8, it'll Instant Death a Terminator too (but not Custodes, funnily enough).
Multilaser: Well, it's a free alternative to the heavy stubber, and Strength 6 is an improvement, but the lack of AP isn't.
Special Rules
Stomp: Gone is the old Stomp table where you can effectively remove a model (or unit) under a pie plate if you roll a 6. Instead, you add D3+ your Knight's Attack Characteristics at Initiative 1 at his Strength, WS and at AP2. Only Knights and super-heavies like Titans, though, not Armigers. Unfortunately, Stomps don't work against other Knights, super-heavies, Titans, Flyers, and models with 8 wounds or more. Don't let that stop you from stomping a Contemptor Dreadnought or a Spartan Land Raider into oblivion, though. This is what you rely on to take out Dreadnoughts when your Reaper chainsword isn't enough.
Flank Speed: Cerastus Knights get this special rule that allows them to add 4" to their movement characteristic (effectively up to 18"), but they can't shoot. They can still charge, though, which is what you want for your Knight Lancer.
Move Through Cover: Your Armigers get this, which means they ignore Difficult Terrain and move really, really fast. Apparently doesn't automatically pass Dangerous Terrain tests, though, but at least your Armigers don't immobilize themselves anymore (like mine did in the old edition). Knights get a superior Move Through Cover, allowing them to ignore Dangerous Terrain completely (and Difficult Terrain).
Fielding Questoris Knights
Any Horus Heresy army can include a Knight as a Lord of War as per normal to the standard Force Organization Chart, but you probably aren't looking at this page to add a single Knight. Nope, what you're looking for is the Questoris Household Detachment.
Questoris Household Detachment
A Questoris Household Detachment allows you to take 2 Compulsory Troops, up to a maximum of 10. For every 2 Troops, you can take a single Lord of War, and you can ignore the max 25% of your army restriction for the Lords of War if you're taking this as your Primary Detachment. You can of course take a Questoris Household Detachment as an allied detachment, but then you'll be subjected to the max 25% restriction.
Household Ranks
When using the Questoris Household Detachment, you may upgrade your Knights (I don't think Armigers count) with Household ranks. Each of these Household ranks come with their special rules, penalties and abilities, so choose wisely. They also turn your Knights into Characters (except the Aspirant).
Seneschal (0-1): You must make this guy your Warlord. He becomes Character, gets +1 BS and +1 WS, and gets the Master of the Household Warlord Trait (see above). It's the most expensive upgrade at a whooping 80 points, but totally worth it as it allows your Knights to make Reactions they otherwise can't.
Arbalester: Gets +1 BS and reroll scatter dice. More accurately, roll two scatter dice and choose one, but you know what I mean. About 10 points more expensive than the Preceptor upgrade, but useful if you're using a bunch of scatter weapons (like the thermal cannon, rapid-fire battle cannon, lightning cannon, etc. - even the magna lascannon or heavy conversion beam cannon).
Aspirant: A discount Knight, giving you a 30 point discount but nerfing your Knight by -1 BS and -1 WS, as well as subtracting 2 from his Movement Characteristic.
Aucteller: Basically the Champion counterpart for your Knights that nets him +1 WS, and when he challenges or is challenged by a Knight, Titan, Primarch, Monster or any model with 8 wounds or more, they get an additional +1 WS (so a grand total of +2 WS) and +1 Attack. Cool against other Knights, but because most Primarchs have WS7 or higher, the additional WS doesn't really do much except ensuring you don't hit on only 6s in combat (though WS5 should technically save you from that). However, with the introduction of Daemons of the Ruinstorm, this should put your Knight on parity with a WS6 Daemon Herald or any of the big Monsters! Best used on a melee Knight like the Knight Lancer or Knight Gallant, though obviously any Knight with a big sword would benefit as well (reaper chainsword, thunderstrike gauntlet, tempest warblade, reaper chainfist).
Dolorus: Gives +1 WS and allows your Knight to perform Sweeping Advances. Cheaper and more reliable than the Aucteller. Obviously, best used on a melee Knight like the Knight Lancer or Knight Gallant.
Preceptor: Gives +1 BS and all Armigers within 6" get better Leadership (9), allowing them to resist Pinning better and they don't fail morale as often. Remember, Armigers are not Fearless. They are only Stubborn, and so they can get swept in combat if you're not careful. Best used in a shooty Knight, e.g. a Knight Crusader. I don't think it works well for something like the Knight Castigator, who already has twin-linked, or the Knight Acheron, who auto-hits with his flamestorm cannon and has twin-linked for his heavy bolter.
Uhlan: Gives +4" movement, Scout and Outflank, but obviously can't be used on Acastus Knights (why would you?). Would be great for Cerastus Knights to increase their already amazing movement, and Questoris Knights also benefit from this too.
Implacable: Your Knight can't lose more than 1 hull point from any attack. As a bonus, gives your Knight an extra Hull Point, but you really want the first ability, which renders your Knight effectively immune to Explodes! results on the vehicle damage table. Second most expensive upgrade, though, so use it on a Knight you really do not want to die.
Unit Analysis
Troops
Armigers
You can take units of 1-4 Armigers for 200 points each, though a meltagun will cost an extra 15 points. Armigers come with the Line and Skirmish rules, which means they are your scoring units, so keep them alive in games where that matters. They are the Knight counterparts of Astartes Dreadnoughts, having a similar statline, though a bit inferior despite being more expensive. They are fast with an 8" movement and Move Through Cover and Fleet (2), are resilient at Toughness 7 and 6 wounds (so Dreadnought statline). They do get a +1 to charges, so yeah. However, don't make the mistake of thinking they can go hand to hand against a Contemptor Dreadnought. Unlike a Contemptor Dreadnought, they only have a 3+ armor save, WS4 and BS4, and no brutal weapons, which means they will get ripped to shreds in melee by one. In comparison, a Contemptor Dreadnought has a 2+ armor save, WS5 and BS5, and they are cheaper (about 175 points before any upgrades).
Oh, and never forget that Armigers are only Stubborn and not Fearless...because their pilots are humans, I suppose? So the Leadership 7 means they will be pinned pretty often, and there's a good chance they will get swept in combat (especially by Fearless Contemptor Dreadnoughts. Figures).
On the plus side, Ionic Deflector gives them Eternal Warrior, which means you won't be losing D3 wounds from Instant Death weapons. So an in-built Implacable, in other words. Hooray. That does nothing against Brutal weapons, unfortunately, so you still need to make separate saves for all those wounds. And they can score, are more spammable than Dreadnoughts in terms of Force Organization Charts - you can theoretically take 10 units of 4, so...10 Armigers in a 2,000 point game, or 15 in a 3,000 point game, without needing any other units. Why you would do that other than for the laughs, I have no idea.
But hey, I guess it's pretty appealing to have an entire army of Toughness 7 walkers with Eternal Warrior running around, right?
Armiger Warglaive Talon: The melta and melee variant Armiger, he has a twin-linked thermal lance with 2 shots. That's right. Twin-linked with 2 shots. Pretty much a superior version of the gravis melta cannon that Contemptor Dreadnoughts are equipped with, and far better than a multimelta, it has 36" range (thus allowing you to get melta range in 18"). For some reason, the thermal lance is only AP 2 despite being a melta weapon, so it's less likely to blow up vehicles. However, it's still effective in killing 2-wounds Terminators thanks to Instant Death at Strength 8. Additionally, the Armiger Warglaive is equipped with a reaper chainblade that is Strength 9 AP 2 with Shred. Though not reliable in fighting Dreadnoughts or their equivalents, Shred boosts your chance of wounding them, and is actually better against infantry, including multi-wound Terminators who will get Instant Death-ed anyway.
Armiger Helverin Talon: The shooty version with two Phaeton autocannons that are MEQ killers with Strength 7 AP3. They are long ranged, so keep them in your backfield and make use of the 64" range. 2 shots each (so 4 total) with Rending (6+) means they can be a threat to anything, including AV14 Land Raiders (though you have to be really lucky with your armor penetration rolls). Has two different rounds that are either Sunder for tank hunting or Ignores Cover for exterminating infantry.
Lords of War
Questoris Knights: The most common pattern of Knights, they have 7 Hull Points, Front AV 13 and side and rear AV 12. Fairly durable with ion shields as well. They are your most flexible chassis, allowing you to swap weapons out to fit your needs (you did magnetize your Knights, right?). They also come with a heavy stubber, which you can upgrade to a meltagun or swap to a multilaser. With a base Strength 8 (for Stomps), 10" movement, Intiative 4 and 3 attacks, as well as BS4 and WS4, they are an all rounder.
-Rapid-fire battle cannon: Nerfed. Comes with a heavy stubber for more dakka, but being Strength 8 AP 4 Ordnance 2 Large Blast (5"), it's no longer the MEQ killer it once was. Can Instant Death MEQs and TEQs if they fail a save, but AP4 means that's unlikely. Still better than most weapons, and is very effective against clumped up Solar Auxilia infantry or Mechanicum units (though Strength 8 will not Instant Death those Toughness 5 Thallax), and will probably be great against Militia. Not as reliable against vehicles, though Ordnance offers some help in that regard.
-Thermal cannon: The most powerful Questoris Knight weapon, it is Strength 8 AP1 large blast (5"), and like the thermal lance, it's 36" range. Just one shot, unlike the rapid-fire battle cannon, but devastating against vehicles (especially if you can roll a 5 on the Vehicle damage table). But the best use of the thermal cannon is TEQ hunting, for it will not only negate the Terminators' 2+ armor save, but also Instant Death them. Still wounding Salamanders on a 3+ instead of a 2+ and probably not Instant Death-ing Iron Hands because of their -1 to Strength from incoming attacks, but against everything else, go ham with it.
-Avenger Gatling cannon: Comes with a heavy flamer, so yay? 12 shots at Strength 6 AP4 with Rending (6+). Again, nerfed so that MEQs can survive more, but the sheer dakka this weapon is capable of means they'll fail several saves at least. Plus the Rending helps. The only weapon you can take double of (like that Lady noble's Knight suit from Dawn of War 3?), so if you're an Ork player coming into Horus Heresy and you need dakka, take dual Avenger Gatling cannons and let them spray.
-Las Impulsor: Look, I know they want to let us make use of all the weapon options in the plastic Imperial Knights box, but...c'mon. The las impulsor is the most expensive Questoris weapon, and appears the strongest at Strength 10 AP2 with Sunder and Instant Death. That is, until you see that it is only 2 shots and has a 12" range. Not only will you be out of range of most targets, if you miss the 2 shots, then...quite frankly, it's a waste of points. It does have its uses, though, killing Custodes outright, and even dealing D3 wounds to Contemptor Dreadnoughts and automata because of the Instant Death (funnily enough, it has no effect on Armigers with Eternal Warrior), but...2 shots and 12"? Better hope your dice is rolling hot. Admittedly, it's awesome to hit both times against a Contemptor Dreadnought, wound both times, have your opponent fail both invulnerable saves, and then you roll 2 3s for the D3 damage and blow up the damned Contempror Dreadnought in a single volley. Otherwise, if you fail to kill it, you're probably f-ed.
Wait, you cry. The las impulsor has a melee profile too! That's right! Strength 10 AP1 Armorbane and Instant Death looks amazing! You'll totally wreck that Contemptor Dreadnought you just charged! Except that the las impulsor also has the Cumbersome rule, which means your Knight is WS1 when using this weapon and thus is hitting the Contemptor Dreadnought on 6s while it hits your Knight back on 3+s (apparently, you are only WS1 when using the weapon, but when your opponent fights back, they count against your natural WS4). Brilliant...well, at least you will be wrecking tanks and buildings with ease, I guess?
-Reaper Chainsword: Strength 10 AP 2 with Shred makes the reaper chainsword super reliable and a weapon you'll always want to have, allowing you to cleave through infantry with ease and Instant Death Terminators. And ensure they stay really dead. It's only decent against other Knights, and though Shred allows you to near guarantee that you wound Dreadnoughts, their 6 (or 7) wounds make it difficult for you to kill them in melee. On the plus side, you can finish them off with Stomps.
-Thunderstrike Gauntlet: Stronger than the reaper chainsword at Strength 12 AP2, with Sunder, this is the anti-tank and anti-knight weapon. Not as good against Dreadnoughts and automata (weirdly, it lacks Armorbane), funnily enough, but it'll definitely destroy almost any vehicle you charge (except Titans or another Knight).
-Carapace Weapons
--Stormspear rocket pod: 3 shot krak missile. The most expensive option, decent against vehicles and does well with anti-MEQ. Instant Deaths TEQs if they fail an armor save, though that's unlikely. But it can still happen, right?
--Ironstorm missile pod: Strength 5 AP4 Large Blast with Ordnance. Probably wouldn't do much, but it still does well against Solar Auxilia, Militia and Mechanicum. Barrage means you don't need line of sight, but that means it scatters the full 2D6.
--Twin-linked Icarus autocannon: The cheapest option, 2 shots at Strength 7 AP4 with Rending (6+), twin-linked. Skyfire means it can hit flying targets, but that's kind of situational.
Questoris Knight Magaera: Like the regular Questoris Knights, he has 7 Hull Points and front AV13, side and rear AV12, and an ion shield (not the ionic flare shield that Mechanicum has, or It Will Not Die). He has in-built Nightvision, but a worse Initiative at 2. Overtaxed Reactor means he blows up more violently, though. Unlike the regular heavy stubber, he comes with a phased plasma fusil that is Strength 6 AP 3 (Breaching 4+), so good against MEQ and even TEQ, but has Gets Hot! He's armed with a lightning cannon that's a Large Blast Strength 7 AP 3 Rending (4+), Exoshock (4+) and Shred. Awesome. Also comes with a reaper chainsword that can be replaced with a siege claw with an irad cleanser and has Sunder and Wrecker.
Questoris Knight Styrix: Almost identical to the Magaera, the only difference is that instead of a lightning cannon, he gets a volkite chieorovile that shoots 5 Strength 8 AP4 shots with Deflagrate. Basically, like all volkites, it's not that good against MEQ and TEQ, but the high Strength means it will Instant Death Terminators in the unlikely event they fail their saves, and do an extra wound. Better pray for your opponent rolling those 1s, I guess. On the plus side, it is absolutely devastating against Solar Auxilia, Militia and Mechanicum, and is decent against light and medium armored vehicles. Don't expect him to destroy a Land Raider in shooting, though. Use your siege claw for that. Oh, he has graviton gun as well, so you can shoot the volkite chieorovile at infantry, your graviton gun (with Haywire) to glance the Land Raider, and then charge it to wreck it with your siege claw. Nice.
Cerastus Knight Lancer: The Cerastus chassis has base Strength 9, which makes them stronger than Questoris Knights, and 14" movement and 4 attacks, but otherwise they have similar stats to the Questoris. The Lancer is different from all the other Knights in that he gets a 5++ invulnerable save in melee because of his ion gauntlet shield, which also downgrades to a 5++ for his front and side armor against shooting, but hey, it's a good trade off. His shock lance can shoot 6 shots at Strength 7 AP3 with Concussive (2) at 18" range, but that's not why you're taking him. You're taking him because his shock lance is Strengh 10 AP 2 Reach (1) and Exoshock (5+) in melee. With his base 4 attacks (5 on the charge) and Initiative 5 (because of Reach giving +1 to his Initiative), he'll be spearing TEQs and other elite infantry to death (Instant Death). Even Custodes. That's how crazy he is. Usually you would want to put one of the Dolorus or Acuteller upgrades on him to give him WS5 so that he'll hit better. He's also decent against vehicles and other Knights (though there was one match where I had my Knight Lancer stuck in combat against a Shadowsword for almost the entire game).
Cerastus Knight Castigator: Dakka Knight that's meant for anti-horde. Similar in stats to the Knight Lancer, which means he has Strength 9, 14" movement, etc., but the only difference is that he carries a standard ion shield instead of the ion gauntlet shield that the Lancer has. Has the Castigator cannon that's pure dakka, throwing out 18 twin-linked shots at Strength 6 AP4. No Rending, unlike the Avenger Gatling cannon, but has Pinning and Shell Shock. He also has a Tempest Warblade that strikes at Strength 10 AP2 like the reaper chainsword, but lacks Shred. Instead, the Tempest Warblade has Deflagrate, which doubles unsaved wounds, and Tempest, which allows your Knight to automatically hit every enemy model in base contact with him at Initiative 2, thus allowing you to deal more attacks than you normally are capable of doing.
Cerastus Knight Acheron: The flamer Knight whose flamestorm cannon is Hellstorm Template Strength 7 AP4 with Shred. His Reaper chainfist gains Armorbane and is Strength 10 AP2, plus a twin-linked heavy bolter as a bonus. This makes him utterly deadly against tanks and vehicles, and even against Dreadnoughts and automata. He might not be an effective MEQ killer, but he certainly will incinerate any GEQ such as Solar Auxilia and Militia.
0-1 Cerastus Knight Atrapos: The good old Knight and Titan hunter. He retains his graviton singularity cannon, which is a Strength 8 AP2 large blast with Haywire and Concussive (1), allowing him to easily wound Dreadnoughts and Instant Death Terminators. His Atrapos phasecutter is less impressive, being only a one-shot Strength 10 AP 1 with Ordnance at 12" range (much like the las-impulsor). But you're not taking him for that. You are taking him for the singularity cannon, as mentioned earlier. In addition to being anti-TEQ and haywire, you have to roll a D6 - on a 1, your poor Knight Atrapos suffers a hull point worth of damage with no saves allowed (basically Gets Hot!). On a 2-5, the weapon fires normally, but on a 6, you get a f-ing vortex that turns it into a dangerous terrain that inflicts Strength 10 AP1 Armorbane and Instant Death to all models standing in it.
Also, you have twin-linked when firing both weapons at super-heavies, such as Knights and Titans, thanks to Macro-Extinction Targeting Protocols. Unfortunately, he sucks in melee because of the same reason the las impulsor is so bad - Cumbersome means he'll be swinging at WS1 and hitting everything at 6s, so don't depend on the Strength 10 AP1 Instant Death and Armorbane phasecutter to do anything in combat. The good news, though, is that if they do kill him in melee, his explosion is AP1, so let him blow up.
0-1 Acastus Knight Porphyrion: The Acastus Knight chassis has front AV14, side AV13 and rear AV12, along with a whooping 9 hull points. They are also Strength 10 for your Stomps. A great idea for your Implacable Knight. The Knight Porphyrion in particular is armed with two twin-linked magna lascannons, which are large blast Strength 10 AP2 Ordnance 2 (yeah, 2 shots each, and twin-linked on top of that! For a total of 4 twin-linked shots!). Not only that, he has two autocannons that can be upgraded to lascannons for extra anti-tank punch. His carapace missile launcher is the standard Ironstorm missile pod identical to the Questoris Knights', but you can swap it out for a Whirlwind launcher with Hyperios warheads that are 4 Strength 8 AP3 with Skyfire and twin-linked to shoot down aircraft.
0-1 Acastus Knight Asterius: Instead of magna lascannons, the Asterius is armed with two twin-linked heavy conversion beam cannons that are large blasts with Blind, but different Strength and AP depending on the range. Between 42" and 72", they are Strength 12 AP1, but between 18" and 42", they are only Strength 9 AP4, and between 1" and 18", they are only Strength 7 AP-. In other words, he's only useful when shooting at targets really, really far away, unless you're shooting at vehicles. He also has the Karacnos mortar battery, which is massive blast (7"), Strength 6 AP4 Rad-phage, Fleshbane, Barrage, Pinning, Shell Shock (3), Crawling Fire and Ignore Cover. That means you can fire at targets without line of sight (but you have to scatter the full 2D6"), they can't take cover saves (not that MEQ cares), you wound all infantry on a 2+, and any unit that suffers an unsaved wound has their Toughness permanently reduced. Not only that, the area the pie plates land on turn into dangerous terrain and starts spreading about. Also comes with two volkite culverins because why the hell not?
Allies
Honestly, Knights can be allied to any Crusade Force, and any allies will benefit them. Armigers might be Line, but both Legiones Astartes and Solar Auxilia (and Imperial Militia) will provide more bodies and boots on the ground. Especially if you want to hide bodies in ruins and camp on objectives, which you can't really do with Knights because they're so big and near impossible to hide.
Mechanicum seems to be a decent ally too, especially since the Archmagos Prime, Tech-priest Auxilia and Magos Dominus can repair Knights with their Battlesmith ability, allowing them to survive longer. Not only that, it also allows you to take Knight Moirax in your army (for some reason, they are not in the Quesstoris Knight Household list, but are available as Heavy Support in Mechanicum detachments).
You can certainly play a pure Knights army, but the joy of having allies as options means that you can shore up whatever weaknesses your army has (low model count), so take the opportunity to experiment around!
In terms of allies, how would you consider the other way around? I'm trying to theme up a destroyer army, and picking between a lancer or a magaera or atrapos as a LOW choice or additional questoris detachment (with its baby knights). Not sure what knights are just fun, but not too OP, choices to add in?
ReplyDeleteI think it'll be a great idea to add a Questoris detachment because the Armigers have Line, they are basically Contemptor Dreadnoughts with lower BS and WS, and can grab objectives. I don't think Knights are overpowered - sure, they are pretty rough for an unprepared opponent, but with all the Rending autocannons, Sunder lascannons and twin-linked multimeltas running around (or gravis melta cannons), plus Dreadnoughts, they can be taken down relatively quickly.
DeleteI think a Lancer and Magaera works great with a Destroyer army. An Atrapos is cool, but remember that his melee is cumbersome, so you probably do not want him fighting Dreadnoughts in close combat.
Thanks for responding, this is really helpful - decisions are so difficult!
DeleteI'll let you know what I decide :)
No problem! I look forward to seeing your decision! Maybe have a few games and see which Knight is best for you!
DeleteThe most important thing is to have fun!
Nice article, thanks! Now I have some idea what I'm getting into with my matchup against Knights tomorrow :)
ReplyDeleteThanks! Good luck for your game!
DeleteHi there, great article man, I have a question since in my local store everyone seems to agree that the Household rank of Implacable will deny exoshock but not the damage on the table (D3 after), do you have any comments or documentation to look at in order to say it's either??? Regards friend!!!!
ReplyDeleteHuh, I guess not. If your local store agrees, then I guess you're probably right. I'm reading the thing and it says "No attack targeting a model with this special rule may inflict more than a single Hull Point of damage" and suffering D3 Hull Points of damage kind of defeats the whole purpose of the Rank. If I'm not mistaken, only Destructor, Exoshock and Torsion Crusher inflict more than single Hull Points of damage per attack. But if you're all agreed on a specified reading of the rule, then I think it's best to go ahead with that - I'm just a random guy on the Internet, ha ha. I don't have Games Workshop's authorization.
DeleteHey man, great article, I have a technical question about the household rank of Implacable, how is it that denies the table?? In my local store they say it's an effect and not the attack itself but I am.not able to find any reference to it anywhere
ReplyDeleteOh yeah, I had a similar question by Freddy I above, and you can read my reply there.
DeleteHello, I have a question, so I printed a Knight that has two heavy stubbers, two shoulder mounted plasma cannons, and a massive, and I mean MASSIVE two handed power hammer, about how many points would he be worth to pull along?
ReplyDeleteUh, I have no idea. Maybe 500 points? What's the weapon stats? Like, Strength, AP, abilities (Brutal? Concussive?).
DeleteI figured his hammer is roughly the same as a ThunderStrike Gauntlet. I wish I could post a picture to show you.
DeleteSounds good to me! I suppose you can just make it the equivalent of a Thunderstrike Gauntlet. And then treat the plasma cannons as 2 large blasts Strength 7 AP4 with Breaching 4+ with 36" range, that would put him around 425 points, if he uses the Questoris stats?
DeleteHe does use Questoris Stats, thank you for the information.
DeleteNo problem, glad to help!
DeleteIs it just me or is the castigator rubbish in a game where there's heaps of 3+ or better saves and it's main gun is going to struggle to hurt anything but the lightest vehicles. I don't get it. I'm not sure why you'd ever take one when a lancer is just flat better at everything most of the time.
ReplyDeleteYou probably take the Castigator against Solar Auxilia and horde armies (or even 20-men tactical squads/Despoilers) where you just trigger the Tempest attack with his sword and mow down the Marines or even Terminators. Heh. But yeah, the Lancer is better in terms of melee and against bigger targets like other Knights and vehicles, where his Reach and Exoshock help him hit faster and harder.
DeleteHowever, against hordes, or even Power Fist/Chainfist Terminators who swing on Initiative 1, having a Castigator trigger Tempest on Initiative 2 and auto-hitting them (thus wiping them out - and don't forget Instant Death because Strength 10 AP2 and Deflagrate that kills even more models) might be more efficient. Because the Lancer still needs to roll to hit, but the Tempest attack auto-hits every single model.
It does less against other Knights and bigger targets like Vehicles, Monsters, Primarchs and Lords of War, though, if you compare to a Lancer with Reach and Exoshock (which doesn't do anything against Monsters and Primarchs).
Hello, I think the Internet swallowed my comment before. Thanks for this article, great primer really , I was looking to do 30k knights and this is very helpful. I can work out the Castigator though, seems kinda junk for a game dominated by 3+ saves and it's going to struggle to do anything to all but the lightest armour... why is it's twin linked mega assault cannon somewhat worse than the Questoris one ? Am I missing something? The lancer is better most of the time. The Acheron is probably better on hordes and probably mire dangerous to hard targets in cc. Castigator just seems to be a nerfed dead choice. Some of the other stuff seems a bit too weak to keep MEQ players happy.... Just my first impressions, I'd be curious as to your thoughts/experience playing.
ReplyDeleteNot sure if you're the same commenter above (who's anonymous), but yeah, Castigator is better in melee against hordes with his Tempest that auto-hits every model in base contact at Initiative 2, plus Deflagrate. You probably take him for that.
DeleteAlso, don't sleep on his Castigator cannon - Shell Shock and Pinning combined will usually force your opponent to snap-shoot, which in some cases might be better than the Questoris's Avenger gatling that has to fish on Rends for a kill (and they'll mostly survivor the AP4 shots or have a cover save). In some cases, pinning a heavy support squad with lascannons and forcing them to snap-shoot next turn might be a life-saver. That said, well...I mean, he certainly isn't the best, that's for sure.
Yeah so with further reading on the system and looking at previous edition for context. These 2.0 rules are trash and kinda look/feel like a punitive nerf / afterthought thrown in the back of the admech book. I was wrong about the castigator. Its the Acheron that makes 0 sense in the list now. How are the cc weapons not at least brutal when they were D before? Why is a lancers cc weapon worse than a contemptors ? Why the blanket AP4 to almost all the ranged options ? So many questions about the design/balance not just internally but in relation to the other 2.0 stuff and the core game changes... Very bad.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I think they overcompensated for the Space Marines...they used to die so easily, so they turned everything into AP4. The Contemptor Dreadnoughts and Dreadnoughts in general becoming their own type and needing Brutal to put them down, in particular, feels excessive.
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